Exclusive: Nick Aldis discusses NWA, All In, Cody Rhodes, Toxicity in TNA & the 'Spot-Monkey vs Old-School' mentality

This weekend, in 2018, the NWA is holding a wrestling PPV event on its 70th Anniversary. I imagine for many of you, if you'd have been told a few years ago that the NWA would be putting on a full show that you'd shake your head and not believe it. Because the NWA was dead, after all?

So how did we get here? Well, Smashing Pumpkins lead Billy Corgan and Ex-WWE and TNA creative Dave Lagana took control of the company and did something quite remarkable. They raised it from being an afterthought, resurrected it from the ashes and rebuilt the brand and the famous 'Ten Pounds of Gold' title to actually mean something to modern wrestling fans.

Someone else entirely influential to the rebirth of the NWA is Nick Aldis, also experiencing somewhat of a career resurgence after rising to fame in TNA as Magnus, even becoming the world champion there. Aldis, along with Lagana and the 'Ten Pounds of Gold' documentary style Youtube series, toured the world defending the title until he was able to set up a show-stealing match with Cody [Rhodes] at the huge independent wrestling event ALL IN. Thus also cementing the NWA as a relevant wrestling promotion again, as it should be!

The atmosphere was special for the Cody and Nick Aldis NWA Title match, and the result, Cody following in his father Dusty Rhodes' footsteps and winning the title felt like one of the biggest and most emotional moments in wrestling over the last five or so years. Now Cody and Aldis are set to do battle in a Best of Three matches at NWA's 70th Anniversary show in what is sure to be another special moment.

I was lucky enough to be able to sit down with Nick Aldis at Wrestling MediaCon in Manchester and talk to him about the incredible moment at ALL IN, and how the NWA is now rightly part of the wrestling conversation again!

"The worst thing you can do is try to engineer a moment like that because it's sort of hokey and weird" - Nick Aldis

I just wanted to add, that this interview was somewhat of an interesting experience for me, not just because Aldis was incredibly open and fantastic to talk to, and not just because the setting of the interview was a Star Wars themed cantina bar, but because, as Nick explained, he never goes anywhere without the camera, and he wasn't wrong as the whole thing was being recorded!

ALL IN happened and your match with Cody was perhaps the most memorable match of the night. Tell me how it feels looking back on it now, and just a little bit more about how it all came together

"Aldis: I had a vision in my head of how the night will go, I think Cody did as well, I think we all did, when you have something like that, you all create an idea in your mind, and obviously with the sell out happening so fast, thirty minutes, that element of it was nothing to worry about! So you go 'Okay, the buildings going to be full'. But then it came to how to get a reaction, we've done all this work, we've done all this build, we've made more effort than anyone else to make this title mean something, to make this match mean something, is it going to pay off?

But I think Cody felt the same and we had, obviously, a lot of chemistry. The thing that people need to remember about that match was that's the first time we've ever wrestled, and anyone who wrestles will tell you the first time you wrestle someone there's always a few kinks, there's a feeling out process.

And I believed it would, but there's no way of being able to predict exactly just how well it's going to work. reading the feedback and the comments during the build I got this impression that it's going to be special, it's going to be a big moment and then when we got to Chicago and we're around people. I did my appearance at Starrcast, I could feel this different energy for our match and I started feeling it, in my mind, because I had held on to this vague idea that we'd have a moment for the bell, but you can't speak it, you can't articulate it, because you can't plan for that, because the worst thing you can do is try to engineer a moment like that because it's sort of hokey and weird. I've seen guys try to engineer a moment like that and it's just tragic.

Next: Aldis discusses ALL IN being the biggest match of his career, why he loves working for NWA as opposed to TNA and whether or not there's a place for 'Spot-Monkeys' in the business.

"ALL IN was the biggest match of my career" - Nick Aldis

Nick Aldis continues to talk about ALL IN and how big a moment it was for him, even going on to add that he believes it was the biggest match of his, and Cody's careers. He also touched on how the match literally came about with NWA and ROH also being involved.

Aldis: "That's what to me was so exciting about it was that obviously, it was the biggest match of my career, the biggest match of his career and that alone is saying something because there's a guy who was in the WWE, and he's had some tremendous success outside of WWE, I've had some of my own success, I've wrestled Sting, AJ Styles, Samoa Joe. I've been involved in the top angles as the champion in TNA, was the first British guy to do it which was very special at the time, but it was the biggest match of our career and we built it with a Youtube show, we built it with social media, we did it ourselves. We didn't have an agent, there's no creative team, it was old-school in every sense."

We got together and the stuff you saw in the build, in the 'Ten Pounds' where we discussed how we negotiated it. That was real. We did get together like two prizefighters and say 'okay, do you want this title match, okay this is what I want, this is what you want, this is what the NWA wants and this is what ROH wants because he's under contract with ROH, but ultimately to stay on the ALL IN gambler, dealer analogy, we held the cards because we wanted to have that match, and once you have two guys that want that match it shows. It was very easy to make it work.

Next: Nick Aldis on not feeling like himself in TNA, how he hoped ALL IN would convince other wrestlers to take big risks and working with lesser experienced wrestlers

"Everything you saw me do in TNA was half-assed, not because I was half-assed, but because it was a compromise of who I saw myself to be" - Nick Aldis

Aldis continued to talk about how he hoped ALL IN would be an inspiring event for those wrestlers out there who maybe aren't satisfied with the position they're in to take more risks. He uses his time in TNA as a reference for this.

Aldis: "To me I hope that it inspires other guys in the business to kind of go and do similar things, but not just that, but to stand up for themselves and to hold on to their own vision of who they are.

Everything you saw me do in TNA was half-assed, not because I was half-assed, but because it was a compromise of who I saw myself to be and who someone else saw me to be, whether it be Vince Russo or whoever. You've seen so much of it in the current product on television, you see guys who you think, there's so much there, but you can just tell they're like 80% because there's always a compromise where twenty different people have got their fingers in this pie, it's too much, it's over-engineered.

We just showed everyone, we stripped it down to the bare bones and thought not only will this match mean something, but it will arguably be the most meaningful match of the year, if not the last five years.

"There's a lot of serendipity with the fact that it's Cody, he's the son of Dusty Rhodes, it's the NWA Title" - Nick Aldis

Aldis went on to add that one of the defining factors of what made the ALL IN match between him and Cody so special was Cody's lineage, and the fact that he was following in his father's footsteps

Aldis: "Yes there's a lot of serendipity with the fact that it's Cody, he's the son of Dusty Rhodes, it's the NWA title but all of that fed into what we were doing and it just, I've been around long enough, Cody and I have been in the business roughly the same amount of time so we both have a very good instinct at this point to know when something is working, when there's meat on this bone. The thing that's most exciting to me is how much more there is to come!

Next: Nick Aldis discusses his status with NWA, why he was drawn to the company and how there's enough room in wrestling for all types and styles

"Now everybody cares about it and now everyone wants it." - Nick Aldis

Nick Aldis continuing the 'Ten Pounds of Gold' story at Wrestling MediaCon

Nick Aldis and Dave Lagana were at Wrestling MediaCon, a week after ALL IN had taken place and whilst they were there they continued the story of the 'Ten Pounds of Gold' by incorporating one final match between Aldis and British legend Doug Williams, putting the #1 Contendership to Cody's NWA Title on the line.

The match with Williams was set up in a 'Ten Pounds of Gold' live panel show the day before, with Lagana, Aldis and Jeff Jarrett all involved. It was a perfect way to develop the story further and a wonderful nod to Williams on the eve of his retirement. Aldis would successfully defeat Doug, cementing his place in a rematch with Cody at the NWA 70th Anniversary show. But I wanted to know if Aldis was sticking with the NWA.

You made a big announcement at Wrestling MediaCon in Manchester that you'd be having your rematch against Cody for the NWA's 70th anniversary show, it is safe to say that your involvement with the NWA is not over yet.

Aldis: I am exclusively involved with the NWA. Everything I'm doing now has been the best run of my career. I don't have a television show, I'm not on television, I don't have a multi-year, high number contract. But Billy Corgan is taking very good care of me, and Dave Lagana is a genius and between us all we've manifested this idea of what we could do with a so-called dead brand and a title that no-one cares about, and now everybody cares about it and now everyone wants it."

Next: Nick Aldis on why he joined NWA, backstage toxicity in TNA and the big fight feel of his match with Cody

"It was always, these wrestling companies, with these toxic office situations, where you have this weird dynamic between office people in wrestling and the wrestlers" - Nick Aldis

Aldis revealed his thoughts on the Jeff Hardy Vs Magnus World Title match at TNA

I also wanted to know why Aldis was drawn to working with Billy Corgan and Dave Lagana for the NWA in the first place, given everything else he'd already done in his career.

Was it doing 'something different' that led to you joining the NWA, with the 'Ten Pounds of Gold' stuff and the documentary style product, obviously having been on TNA, was it this that attracted you to it?

Aldis: Yes, and it was also the idea of working with Dave and Billy, it was the idea of working on something from the ground up, and being able to be 100% the person that I imagined myself to be and prove that my ideas were right.

In TNA I had a moment there when I was wearing the suits, where I was doing that stuff, but it was always like, 'oh but I have to do it like this'. I hate to live in the past, but I'll never get over when they said that I was going to wrestle Jeff [Hardy] for the title in Orlando in December. And I said 'we're going to be in London in one month, and I'm a babyface, why can't we wait, we could have the biggest moment in the company history." It would've been the biggest reaction and we would've filled Wembley Arena, I guarantee it, even with that one month. If they had said he finally gets the chance to be the world champion at Wembley."

Aldis: "It was always, these wrestling companies, with these toxic office situations, where you have this weird dynamic between office people in wrestling and the wrestlers where it becomes this war, this silent cold war between them, it's like 'is that what he wants? I'll show him'. Don't we all want the same thing? We're in the business of making moments. We got together with this [ALL IN] and went 'whats the moment here? What's the big moment? What's the business? What did we get into this business to do?' We all knew what it was and we did, and we did it so well that there was 11,000 standing before we've even touched."

Next: Nick Aldis talks about the 'old-school', or should I say 'classic' style match he and Cody put on, plus the merits of telling a story as opposed to just hitting all of your moves

"I just wanted to prove that the real art in this, the real work, is in getting people to the point where, when it happens, it makes people feel something" - Nick Aldis

Nick Aldis on the 'Classic' match he had with Cody at ALL IN

The whole ALL IN show was great, but that truly felt like a big moment and a big match with the entrances, you had Jeff with you and Cody had his guys with him. And the match itself felt very 'old-school', was that a deliberate decision or?

Aldis: "I wouldn't call it 'Old-School', I'd call it 'Classic'. I think wrestling's for everyone and I truly and genuinely believe that. Which is why I don't judge people who decide to dump each other on the head ten times and hit a finishing move five times before they can win a match. I don't know how it's a finishing move if it takes five of them, but that's your prerogative.

I just wanted to prove that the real art in this, the real work, is in getting people to the point where, when it happens, it makes people feel something. It's not just a physical demonstration of skill, that's one element of a very layered industry that we're part of. We're somewhere between making movies and athletics."

Aldis: "When it's done perfectly, as I've got older, I fell in love with the 80's NWA Flair and Steamboat, Magnum TA and Tully Blanchard, Flair and Dusty, Dusty and Harley Race, these were the guys where the atmosphere was like a sports atmosphere. I come from an athletic background, I miss feeling like an athlete as opposed to just a performer. The idea that we could create a situation where this is the world title on the line, this is it. It's Rocky!

What's blown me away is still just hundreds and hundreds of emails and tweets of people saying 'I've watched it eight times' or 'I haven't felt like this since I saw Warrior and Hogan' and that's too much for me to process, because I'm like 'there has to be something else'. And at some point you have to take ownership, it's not an arrogant thing but you have to take ownership and go 'Alright, I'm in the spot I've always wanted.' But now we need to build on it going forward."

Next: Aldis talks defending the NWA Title on the road, helping younger guys get over and inflatable penises!

"Suddenly all of my bookings were coming back to me and asking "What do we have to do to make it a world title match" - Nick Aldis

Flip Gordon and Cody were two of many wrestlers Aldis defended 'The Ten Pounds of Gold' against

I was lucky enough to see a NWA Heavyweight Title match earlier in the year when Nick Aldis defended the belt against a British wrestler called Big Grizzly for a local promotion near me called Pro Wrestling Chaos.

However, this is one of the many title matches Aldis competed in this year, as he's been on a 'Ten Pounds of Gold' crusade to defend the title against as many different opponents as possible.

Outside of ALL IN, you've done a great job of building up the NWA World Heavyweight Title, travelling around and defending in from city to city. I was lucky enough to see you in Bristol against Big Grizzly for the title at Pro Wrestling Chaos. But you were defending the title almost every day. What was that like?

Aldis: "It was something that happened organically because we had a lot of bookings already, but when the NWA thing kicked off and we started doing 'Ten Pounds' all of this happened organically.

Billy had a plan for the NWA as a business but content-wise he sort of left that up to us for the most part. Obviously, he's the executive producer so nothing is done without him going 'okay' but the day to day credit belongs to Dave Lagana, and the style of content and the delivery and the, and this the point that's very important, the speed of which it's delivered. That's just an incredible work ethic.

But what happened was immediately we started feeling this energy shift, like the vibrations were coming to us. Suddenly all of my bookings were coming back to me and asking "What do we have to do to make it a world title match, can we make it a world title match?" At first we were thinking do we try to limit this, do we make it a special attraction. Or do we just... and in the end if everybody wants it, why don't we give it to everybody. Aren't we trying to build this brand? Aren't we trying to build the title?

It was also great practise for me to, there's a difference between doing a regular match and doing a world title match, and that's why we did that. We perfected the formula of the in-ring introduction, the in-ring instructions to the referee, the style of the entrances, just the overall presentation of it."

Next: Aldis discusses giving people a 'steak' as opposed to an 'All you can eat buffet' and his thoughts on people who say you can only like one style of wrestling

"The clown might be your favourite guy, but you don't want to see the clown do the trapeze, get shot out the cannon, or ride the elephant." - Nick Aldis

Nick Aldis and Tim Storm was a real heavyweight rivalry

Aldis continued to talk about the merits of touring the world with the NWA Title and defending it against much younger, lesser known and lesser experienced guys.

Aldis: "I took it as a badge of honour because I worked with a lot of guys who are much less experienced and it's a chance to give them a taste of 'if you trust me, I will get you over, if you trust me I will show you how you can get over, on your own, without me.'

Because it's all patience, I see so much wrestling now where guys are just like, throwing out an all you can eat buffet, and an all you can eat is great every now and then, but I just want a really nice steak, or I just want a really nice piece of fish or whatever."

Aldis: "But the culture is so heavily ingrained in 'Oh, I don't want anyone to criticise me so I'll just do every move I can think of, like five times, because I don't want anyone to think that I'm lazy and having a bad match.' And I'm like, doing a bunch of moves for no reason and killing yourself is not only dumb, but it's lazy too because you're just not making the effort to emote, or making the effort to tell a story, or making the effort make people feel something.

The thing I loved about ALL IN more than anything, was that it was 11,000-ish by the time it was said and done, and there was so little trolling on that show. There were little collections of people that tried to do it but they just got drowned out because people were like 'F*** that'. We're here to just, this is a moment and this is a real thing, and if I can be a positive part of wrestling that eliminates that thing, there's more than enough room for every taste here."

Aldis: "I loved that six-man tag at the end. What I really loved about it was that they had their time cut massively and still killed it. I love those guys. The reason I was on that show was because I have such a good relationship with the Bucks. There's this really weird assumption with the very die-hard fans of the Bucks that we couldn't possibly like each other and be friends and respect each other's work because we wrestle totally differently. Nick and Matt text me because they'd just watched the match because they hadn't seen it and they loved it Because I didn't do the kind of stuff that they do.

Matt Cross, one of my favourite opponents, we tore the house down in Tennessee, I love him, I think that he's so underappreciated, he's not underrated, that's a world I wish would disappear, but underappreciated, but he was like 'I can't wait for us to work together again' and he's excited about all the things I bring to the table that he doesn't and vice-versa. That's the business, not this kind of like, oh 'he must think I'm a spot-monkey because he's a heavyweight' or 'he must be a lazy cookie-cutter wrestler because he's a heavyweight and doesn't do flips', no!

We're telling stories. It doesn't matter. We're all here for everyone. When the circus comes to town, my analogy is this, the clown might be you favourite guy, but you don't want to see the clown do the trapeze, get shot out the cannon, or ride the elephant. Let someone else do that. When everyone plays their role and does it to the best of their ability, that's when you get these nights where people go 'what a show'. You know, it's a four hour show and four hours is too long normally. I've been to plenty of independent shows that are four hours and drag.

There professional wrestling shows out there that struggle to keep people interested for four hours...

Aldis: "Of course, because it's over engineered, it's not what people want. If it's four hours of stuff people want it doesn't matter. Ian Riccaboni at the start said 'it's a love letter to professional wrestling' and I loved that line, I thought that was brilliant, because that's really what it was. It was like 'hey, here's all the things we love about pro-wrestling.' We had an old-school traditional as they come NWA World Title match, followed by inflatable penises. I loved that!"

Joey Ryan brings something different to wrestling, and that's all right according to Nick Aldis

You can catch NWA's 70th Anniversary Show on October 21st. It's available for live streaming on the FITE TV app!